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Post by blu3wolf on Nov 7, 2019 12:36:07 GMT
Mmm. Cyberboard seems like it would work well for games which are strictly IGOUGO, but CNA is not strictly in this category, with all the decisions being made during the opponents turn and all. It wouldnt prevent you using it, but it does seem like it wouldnt be the most ideal solution.
On the other hand, if it handles stacks that would be useful.
The counters arent hard to make, just theres a lot of them. I figure its easy enough to make them as I need them, for my own game at least. I had them all made, but then I decided I wanted them to look a bit nicer than the flat scans of the counters.
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Post by rangerdave on Nov 9, 2019 5:20:24 GMT
ATD,
Thanks, Always interested in looking at spreadsheets. I've checked out the ones on this site that, I could access. My sheets tend to be Player Aid sheets that are manually (Cut/Copy/Paste). My focus has been on using the computer to help track data and make the game process go faster - not to actually play it on the computer (thats way beyond my ability to do). I've had mine for years and all the CNA data is in excel. I even tried CNA on MS Access but couldn't get it to all come together. Excel worked best for me. I am tweaking my combat VBA/macros and hope to soon complete a full turn with no major issues.
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Post by ATD on Nov 15, 2019 11:04:47 GMT
Indeed - same comment to both subjects: not intended to computerise play. : )
The play system will, of necessity, be highly incremental due to the mentioned level of interactivity during play. Cyberboard, or anything that fixes the positions of the counters digitally and is capable of being shared, will suffice. Simplicity, visual clarity, convenience and robustness are the main considerations.
MS Access alone, as you have found yourself, is not up to the job (I looked at it myself, prior to embarking on the program code). Excel becomes fiddly and programming in VBA is an "unpleasant" experience!
Our best solution is the formation of a game via the members of this site, with the code that I've created. The British Commonwealth land forces are already entered. If anyone would like to enter the Axis forces and first line supplies on the program, let me know...
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Post by blu3wolf on Nov 16, 2019 11:31:55 GMT
How hard is that?
Is there sufficient interested players to run Axis with more than one player? I dont mind jumping in for either side, but I feel like it might be worth having the opportunity to discuss what first line supplies should look like at the start. I can do data entry, but does doing so volunteer me to be the solo(?) axis player?
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Post by rangerdave on Nov 27, 2019 3:16:04 GMT
I can enter data. Just need to know what you want and in what format. I have all the Italian Campaign Start Data in excel in various configurations. I prefer playing as the Axis.
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Post by ATD on Nov 29, 2019 12:15:08 GMT
Well done chaps. I must get this board to notify me when there are posts to it!
Data entry on the program is a breeze (that's why I wrote it). : ) You would need a system capable of running the program but that's pretty standard stuff (at least on Windows, which will call for and update any necessary system files).
There are game complications, such as the assignment of 1st line supplies (and possibly a choice of 1st line trucks and distribution between). There are also the unit counter symbols to made available, so that they can be added easily within the program.
The solution for now would be to enter all the fixed items and leave the rest for the game start. It's possible to port most data from existing spreadsheets but a monumental faff on. The entry could be shared between players if decided and it all needed to be proof checked, as we don;t want Graziani turning up with just three mates and his dog.
Each side will require 2-4 players.
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Post by rangerdave on Dec 4, 2019 3:24:57 GMT
Just let me know how I can be of assistance.
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Post by ATD on Dec 5, 2019 15:58:45 GMT
Wilco
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Post by blu3wolf on Dec 8, 2019 13:14:46 GMT
Well done chaps. I must get this board to notify me when there are posts to it! Data entry on the program is a breeze (that's why I wrote it). : ) You would need a system capable of running the program but that's pretty standard stuff (at least on Windows, which will call for and update any necessary system files). There are game complications, such as the assignment of 1st line supplies (and possibly a choice of 1st line trucks and distribution between). There are also the unit counter symbols to made available, so that they can be added easily within the program. The solution for now would be to enter all the fixed items and leave the rest for the game start. It's possible to port most data from existing spreadsheets but a monumental faff on. The entry could be shared between players if decided and it all needed to be proof checked, as we don;t want Graziani turning up with just three mates and his dog. Each side will require 2-4 players. Well, Im not currently running on Windows. I have had some success with a compatibility layer for windows programs (wine) with plugins for dotnet and v runtime distributions.
For my symbol needs, Ive been using a font which is the NATO symbols. Its most of what I need. Frustratingly, it seems that the symbols CNA uses are not NATO standard, but are more along the lines of US Army Engineers symbols, circa 1960. Outside hex and counter wargames, its not really something thats been needed enough to make a font for it. The font I found has many of the CNA symbols, but not all of them.
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Post by ATD on Dec 8, 2019 13:53:12 GMT
All the accurate symbols are available for extraction from the Cyberboard module.
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Post by blu3wolf on Jun 13, 2020 16:19:40 GMT
On that note, the current VASSAL module seems very full featured, at least regards accurate symbols and map.
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Post by ATD on Jun 25, 2020 15:33:35 GMT
I'm now wondering whether a centralised digital map (which was the original idea) is worth pursuing - at least at commencement.
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Post by blu3wolf on Jun 26, 2020 7:46:03 GMT
Couple obvious options present themselves. I investigated using Roll20, an online gaming website, for the purpose, last year if memory serves. That would be a shared board, but thats about it - all rules enforcement would be up to the players. I added some counters, but that would be required to be ongoing as needed. Not impossible. Performance was okay, but not as responsive as I wanted. I think I shared some screenshots of it to this forum, somewhere.
VASSAL is a pretty great tool, but Im not sure if it has the ability to be used as a multiplayer server? There is some lobby feature, so that might bear some investigation - if it could be used, it has the benefit that it already has all the counters in the module. Like Roll20, it still lacks any kind of rules enforcement - its just a board. Albeit a pretty one at that.
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Post by ATD on Jun 26, 2020 9:30:53 GMT
Thanks blu...
If anything this this were used, I think a simple map positioning system is all the use we would make of it. As you indicate, it would need to service multiple users and that involves a huge amount of complication in the system software - more than casual observers would realise. I've had to overcome many such obstacles in the CNA multi-user system.
Fortunately, CNA comes with a map and counters too. : )
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Post by blu3wolf on Jun 26, 2020 16:26:21 GMT
It seems VASSAL has a centralised server that could facilitate a shared map common to all users. This would require a computer to be connected at all times, essentially acting as the 'host' computer. Roll20.net hosts its own version of its maps, but would require accounts made for each player (free) on the website. The free accounts have advertisements, however. VASSAL does not seem to require an account to use its multiplayer connection.
Id be inclined to suggest that a central shared map of some kind is essential. As both the suggestions Ive mentioned have drawbacks, Id recommend others look into both those options, and any other alternatives, rather than relying solely on my take on it.
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